Embracing our mortality can transform the way we live—and in this episode, hospice nurse and author Penny Hawkins Smith shows us how. Drawing from decades of experience and her own journey of overcoming addiction, Penny shares heartfelt stories about life, death, and the lessons they teach us. Her compassionate perspective reveals how accepting the inevitability of death can help us live with greater purpose, love, and grace. This conversation will leave you with a renewed sense of clarity and empowerment, inspiring you to cherish every moment, deepen your relationships, and live your most meaningful life starting today.

Imagine being able to communicate clearly with your angels, hear their messages, and use that guidance to create the life you want. That’s exactly what the Angel Membership is here to help you do. A new year begins February 1st. Have questions? Book a personal call with me below — I’d love to chat about our programs!

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Transcript:
  Hello, beautiful souls. Welcome back to the angels and awakening podcast. So sorry if the vocals sound a little bit different and the intro and outro today, um, we’re still working on a whole new podcast studio, but I wanted to just start today by inviting you to get calm, get centered, invite your angels in.

And we’re going to start by just having you take a deep breath in through your nose. Out through your mouth.

And as you continue to breathe deeply while we’re together this hour, I want you to feel your body soften more and more and more. Friends, I know that for so many of us, life feels very overwhelming. Uh, at times, maybe you’re feeling a little unsettled, anxious, or like everything around you is just moving too fast.

It’s a sign that our nervous systems are dysregulated. Um, or in other words, right, it’s that our body is in this state of fight. flight, freeze, or fawn, instead of really being in peace, trust, and divine flow. And I believe that when our body is in this dysregulated place and you feel it, it’s really the most important time to center your energy.

And, um, really it’s the most important time to Listen to your intuition. I don’t believe that you can’t hear your intuition when your nervous system is dysregulated. What I actually believe is that’s one of the biggest first signs for empaths. Oh, I need to do some processing here. I need some information.

And for a lot of us. The way that we find peace itself is actually by looking at all of the different information, understanding everything, and then from our own consciousness being able to tune in to our intuition, ask questions of spirit, ask questions of your angels, and figure out what Best and right for you, for your family.

What your angels want you to know right now is this, and they’re standing right beside you, wrapping you in love and whispering to you in this moment. You are going to be safe. You are safe. You are loved. You are guided. You do not have to figure it out alone. When we’re caught up in stress, worry, or fear, it’s really easy for us to get stuck in our heads, cycling through thoughts, trying to maybe control or predict the future.

But the angels remind us that true wisdom doesn’t come from really like, overthinking. It comes from stillness. It comes from that trust, from that soft inner knowing that you’re divinely supported always. And so I want you to do this with me. Let’s just do a complete reset of your energy with the help of your angels.

If you can, if you’re in the car, uh, keep your eyes open. We don’t want you closing your eyes in your car. Um, but if you’re in a place where you can close your eyes, even if you’re walking, I just want you to stop for a moment, close your eyes, place a hand on your heart, and I want you to call all of your angels in to surround you.

I want you to feel the presence of Archangel Raphael. The healer of all energy imbalances within the physical body. Archangel Michael who releases fear and brings protection. And I want you to feel the presence of your own guardian angels who know exactly what your soul needs in this moment, right here, right now.

I want you to take another deep breath.

And as you do, I want you to visualize a warm, golden, loving energy filling your entire being. This love is your angels realigning you, bringing you peace to your nervous system and helping you to return to trust.

As you’re in this moment right here right now, I want you to ask your angels for a message. It might be a feeling, a word, an image, or just a really deep sense of peace, knowing that you’re going to be okay, that you are held.

Tune into what that message is for you right here, right now.

Friends, your angels want you to know that your inner wisdom is your intention. Is your intuition and it is your soul that is speaking to you. And when your nervous system is at peace, because you, you bring it to that point by doing your work, you know, um, You know that you’re kind of getting dysregulated and you pause throughout your day to come back to center.

It is you re regulating yourself to really make sure that we’re not, um, just consuming, consuming, consuming, but that we’re really tuning into, uh, our own hearts and what we need to know because, uh, as I was tuning in to. Your angels and asking them, you know, what do people need to know right here, right now, what they want you to know this week is that now more than ever before you need to be aware of everything that’s going on.

Um, you need to be well read if you’re not a good. Middle person to really watch and and keep track of her work To stay in the know Is heather cox richardson. She is a Person a journalist who only records the facts um Be in the know so that you’re able to then Pause, reflect, tune in, and allow your angels to guide you.

Again, your angels want you to know that one of the things that happens with a lot of empaths is that you feel way into the future. Okay? And not everybody does this. So there are a lot of people on the planet, right? And let’s say over half of them, um, you know, only are kind of using their intuition to process what’s happening right now within the world.

And they’re processing and they can only see tomorrow or the next day into the future. Um, empaths are a percentage of the population. Who, um, cannot not see far into the future, right? Like they can see six months down the road. They can see a year down the road. They can see 10 years down the road. And so, um, what ends up happening is a lot of you who are empathic right now, you might be looking around being like, well, I feel like I’m crazy.

Like, why doesn’t everybody see this? It’s because they can’t. They don’t have that ability. And um, so what I need you to know, what your angels need you to know, is that the more that you can Be aware of what’s going on and then come back to yourself. Regulate your emotions. Do some breath work. If you’re in the angel membership all month long, we’re working on oneness.

I didn’t plan it that way. The angels did. Um, we’re working on healing the whole you. through oneness and vibration. So tune into those meditations, work on those meditations, and then ask the angels questions. And friends, if you’re like, Julie, I can’t hear what the angels are saying. I can’t hear what spirit is saying.

Um, The most important thing that you could ever do for yourself is really understanding how to hear your angels, your guides, your loved ones in heaven, because they’re always talking to you and they are giving you Pieces of information that are going to help you most on your path. Um, and so if that’s something that you need help with, I would love to help you with that and the angel membership all year long, that is what we are working on, making sure that you know exactly who’s on your, uh, spirit team, which angels are working with you, what signs they’re sending you, what loved ones are working with you.

How they’re working with you and you’re going to be working on so much this year through our weekly live events. If all you did was come into the membership and just do those weekly live events, oh my gosh, it would center you and balance you and just keep you in love and harmony. Um, and that’s what we want.

So friends, I love you so much. Um, oh, one more thing. For those of you interested, we are doing the Angel Reiki school in person. It’s April 11th, 13th in Oakbrook, Illinois, one of the best suburbs over here. And, uh, it’s really easy to fly into Chicago or O’Hare. Um, definitely get ahold of me in the show notes, uh, or via email julie at the angel medium.

com. My website’s the angel medium. com. And, uh, yeah, I’d love to talk to you. I love you so much. So much friends. Now let’s hop into today’s show. Hello, beautiful souls. Welcome back to the angels and awakening podcast. I’m your host and author, Julie Jancis and friends today. We’re here with a very special guest.

You probably know her as hospice nurse, Penny. Penny, welcome to the show. Thank

you. Thank you for having me.

Oh, of course. I’m so excited, um, because your work is all about teaching us how to reframe death, to live better. Uh, your new book influencing death, uh, really goes into the work that you’ve done over the years.

And I’m so excited to just ask you questions and have you tell stories. Stories to our audience. So you are a hospice nurse and, um, a lot of people within the community are interested in becoming a death doula. I wondered if you could talk about what you do as a hospice nurse. And do you ever work with death doulas who come in to kind of help with that transition?

I haven’t ever worked with any death doulas. Death doulas are. Unfortunately, not reimbursable by insurances, so hospices don’t hire death doulas, so I haven’t really worked with them. I know that they do non medical care, and that’s very different from what hospice nurses do. We do medical care, medical support, we are doing assessments, evaluating people for, um, whatever kind of symptom management they may need.

We’re doing education with the families around death and dying and the dying process and how to care for their dying person.

I was just talking this morning with a friend, um, and telling her about the hospice nurses that I’ve gotten to spend time with. And it feels to me that they have a different part in their energy where they feel more free to live the life that they want to live because they, the, the, the folks that I have talked to, they really don’t see dying as a death at all.

Um, they see it as kind of a process. A lot of people see it as very sacred. How do you see it?

I see it both as a process and very sacred, you know, seeing people dying. who are your age or younger, especially, or you can identify almost with every patient, no matter what age they are, because you know someone, you love someone that is that age, and it really makes you value the life that we get to live.

And you, you really start to Not sweat the small stuff as much anymore. That’s not to say I still don’t get aggravated if a spoon is stuck in the kitchen drawer. But, you know, we it really puts things into perspective. You just really do understand that life is life. It’s we’re all going to die. None of us gets out of here alive.

Life is something that we should treasure and appreciate as much as possible.

So the podcast audience knows this, but as we’re recording this, it’s December 12th and we’re rolling in here. This is probably going to air in 2025. And in, uh, fall, early fall of 2024, um, I was going through a lot of health complications and I didn’t know what was happening to my body, what was going on.

And there were a period of about two weeks where I really was uncertain of whether or not this was something very, very major, um, life threatening or not. And I had intuition about it, but also. Of fear is just immense when you are uncertain of what’s happening. And I was going into the hospital, they were giving me, uh, morphine and heavy duty medications for pain management, which I don’t like to be on any medications at all.

I, I don’t like to feel loopy. Um, but there was a period of time where I couldn’t look at my husband without crying or even really talk to anybody without crying. And it does shift. Your perspective, even me working in what I do, I felt like, well, I know that that time is going to come hopefully when I’m old and gray, the, the fear that comes in with that.

Shifts your perspective and everything felt a little bit more real, a little bit more, um, you want to hold on to every moment. You just want to cherish the connection that you have with your child and with your partner and enjoy your present time with them. And I wish almost. That that would last, you know, that just feeling of how sacred everything is.

But then when you get back into the hustle and bustle of life, you kind of just have to live and, and that’s more shoved to the back burner of your brain. Do you feel that way as a hospice nurse or because you’re around it all the time, do you constantly have that, I have to make this sacred in my life because I could be gone at any time.

No, no, not at all. I’m, I’m human, so it’s the same. There are times when it’s more present and prevalent, and there are times when it’s life and you’re living it, but I don’t necessarily think that’s a bad thing, because when I was younger, I suffered from death anxiety. I had no idea. That that was even a thing that other people suffer from until I got on social media and so many people in my comments were like I’m afraid of death.

I have death anxiety and I was like, wow, you know, I had that as well when I was when I was younger and and you just have this Perseveration about what happens after we die. What is dying going to be like and it it really impacts how you’re able to live because you’re so caught up in worrying about dying that you’re not able to enjoy life.

So I, I think it’s good to have those moments that bring you back to life is sacred, we need to cherish this, we need to do as much as we can while we’re alive and then also just to have real life where you’re not thinking about the fact that you’re, you’re dying. You know what I mean? Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Yeah. Because it can, it can get to the opposite extreme where it makes you just dread every moment because you’re just constantly thinking about it. And I, and I also want to say, it’s really normal to have that fear like you had. You said you’re in this space. It’s a little surprising that you felt that fear all of a sudden.

I always say, people ask me all the time, are you afraid of dying? And I say, no, I’m not afraid of dying, but I’m not sitting in a doctor’s office being told that I have a finite amount of time. If I was, that would scare me. I would be scared too. Even though I’ve been a hospice nurse for 20 years and I know that we’re all going to die and I normalize death and dying, it would still be scary to me because I like you and like most people, I want to live to be a ripe old age and die quietly in my bed.

So.

You know, this is so fascinating. It’s something that you said spurred a thought where I’ve never thought to myself that people would have anxiety about dying because they’re worried about what it’s going to be like on the other side. That I’m not scared of at all. Um, the part that I am so fearful of is, you know, Leaving, you know, leaving my daughter, leaving my husband.

Um, that wouldn’t make me cry right now if I let myself go into it. Uh, And I feel that a lot with the people that I’ve worked with who are, um, knowing that they’re going to pass and wanting to make peace with it, that there’s this energy within them. That’s very rooted into who they are in this life. And it feels energetically that they have to, I guess, make peace and release some of that energy.

And as they do, they kind of lift up those roots. And to me, it feels like as a person is passing, the energy is almost coming up through the feet up through the head where it’s like a reverse, uh, what do they call that hourglass where all of the energy is draining, but through the crown and returning to the other side.

Does that make sense?

Yeah, I love that you said that because biologically that happens as well. We say the people die from the feet up, that’s kind of a saying in hospice. And biologically it’s because as the body’s going through a dying process, it, that is a process that has to be completed. If a person is dying a natural death and they’re not having a sudden, death, a cardiac event, or something that causes them, or traumatic death.

If they’re dying a natural death, it’s a process that has to be completed. In order for that process to complete, the vital organs, the heart and lungs, these need to keep going until the very end. And so, the body is intuitively shutting down circulation, because we, we don’t need that oxygenated blood going to our feet, we’re not walking anymore.

So it’s all coming here, and we start to see people’s Feet getting cold and blue models, you know, and that works its way up. So, uh, it is, it is really actually physically the energy is shifting from their body out there.

That’s wild because I did not know that fact, but you can feel that happening just energetic wise.

That’s so interesting. Okay, I’ve got another question for you. You know how, you know, some women when they get labor, uh, go through labor and they have a baby, some women want to be in the hospital, some people want to be at home. More naturally. I don’t believe that there’s a right or wrong. Do what feels called to you.

Is there a difference? Because so many people are medicated now Pain management as they’re passing. Is that a good thing? Is there more of an experience that we go through without the medicine? I’m just not aware

No, so and let’s make the distinction between a natural birth and a natural death because a natural birth Usually there’s no drugs involved, right?

That’s what a woman who does a natural birth doesn’t want any drugs a natural death. You can still have drugs Because you’re, you’re dying, you’re dying without a medical intervention to prolong your life. You’re dying a natural, you’re dying from natural causes, you’re having a natural death. So people can have medications.

But I, my feeling is that people who are under medicated, especially if they have cancer that causes extreme pain, or any other symptoms that are really extreme and causing them suffering, are not able to experience the pain. It’s a sacred, beautiful part of death. Yeah. It’s because they’re so uncomfortable.

And so a lot of times I’ve seen where people cannot relax enough to let go and die. They can’t complete the journey because they’re so uncomfortable. But once we medicate them and they’re able to relax, then they can die. They can finally, you know, take their last breaths and go on to the next wherever.

So yeah, I’ve had patients who did not want to have any, any pain medication and some of them in the end finally conceded to having it because it was just too uncomfortable for them without and others really struggled until the very end. And I’ve had patients who didn’t have medication and didn’t need it.

So, you know, when we talk about things like deathbed visions and people say, well, it’s because of the medications. No, because there are people who don’t get medication who are experiencing those deathbed visions just as well as somebody who does.

Wow! Like, mind blown. That’s amazing. Well, let’s talk about some of those visions because you and I chatted briefly before, uh, this, and you said that you haven’t had people talk about angels per se, but they always see their loved ones.

Yeah, so I haven’t ever had anybody tell me that they could. See angels or Jesus and and I’m not saying that people don’t have those visions. I just have not Experienced that with my patients with my patients I’ve seen them seeing people that they knew who have died or even pets at times. So My the most interesting thing that I remember happening is when I worked at a hospice care center so my my My hospice background is that I started working in hospice care centers.

And that is where people are coming with acute symptom management needs. And they’re typically very, very close to the end of their life. Often these are patients with cancer who have an exacerbation of their symptoms because they’re close to the end of their life. So they usually died at the care center.

So I was really at the bedside in your face, death and dying for many, many years. That was my, my background. And, uh, one time the call light went off to alert me to one of the rooms and I went in and my patient asked me to help her find her cat that was in the room. And we did allow pets at the care center.

So that wasn’t that unusual. But we asked that somebody be in the room with the, with the animal, an adult, that wasn’t the patient because we didn’t want the patient having to look after the animal. So I was like, well, it’s kind of odd that nobody’s in here, but it’s not that odd that she has a cat in the room.

So I’m looking for this cat. Looking under the bed, looking in the wardrobe, looking in the bathroom, and finally she says, Oh, I just realized that, uh, that’s not, my cat is not here. That was a cat that I had when I was a child.

Wow. Because you do see this where animals can be part of somebody’s spirit team on the other side.

Um. Wow, I just love that. Um, and you have had people talk about loved ones being at their bedside. One of my favorite stories from within the family is that, uh, when a grandpa was passing away, people at his bedside said that he was talking about a party that he could see everybody on the other side, that they were all nicely dressed.

And he was talking about how he had to find his nice. suit and his nice shoes and he had to shine his shoes because he needed to look good for his party.

Yeah, I’ve had, I’ve had similar situations and, and that, and another interesting thing about what you’re talking about, that experience is saying that he needed to shine his shoes.

We also have patients who have travel language where they talk about needing to go somewhere, needing to get somewhere without expressing that they’re seeing the party, but actually saying these things like, I need to go home. I’ve had many, many patients, I go to their house and the spouse is like, we argued all night last night because he kept saying I need to go home, and I kept telling him, you’re in the same house you’ve lived in for 20 years.

Home means something different, so that’s travel language. The other thing that I find really fascinating, and it’s something that didn’t even, I didn’t really put two and two together about this for many, many years, but people who are dying will often do things with their hands. Sometimes they do things like.

If they were smokers, they pretend they’re smoking a cigarette, or I’ve had lots of patients who did this, and I go, what, what, tell me about this, tell me about what this is, and the family would say, he’s a fly fisherman, and he’s tying his flies, but the most common thing people do is they reach up. They reach up, they reach over to the corner of the room, they reach into the air, and people who are having those deathbed visions will often say they’re up there, or they’re over there, and so there gets a point, so Let me just say too, I want to give you the disclaimer on deathbed visions.

We say deathbed visions, but they can happen weeks before a person dies, before they’re in their deathbed. Sometimes they start as dreams. People will say they’re having dreams of, of these deceased loved ones, but they can start weeks ahead of time. So, These are people that can be not medicated, completely lucid, able to say, I see so and so in the room.

And so, so, expressing this to us, but then they get further down the road in their dying process, they’re no longer talking to us. They’re still doing these things, so we can’t say, what are you doing, what are you reaching for? But in my mind, I’ve connected the dots, you know, I’ve had so many patients who said, you know, dad is up there and they’re reaching up there.

So I think really that’s what they’re, they’re doing. They’re reaching for those. People and I fully believe that they what they say they see absolutely is there

well and it’s so similar with babies you hear all the time that when a mother father first bring home their baby from the hospital there in the nursery and the baby is just Looking around the room and really looking at a specific area up, um, and seeing something and a lot of people make it out to be ghosty, but I really believe that it’s them seeing their loved ones that’s come through in so many different sessions, which is just wild because it really proves to me, actually, it proves that there is something within babies and early Children and those towards the end where there is a.

Thinning of the veil per se, and they’re seeing something that we cannot in our, in between.

Yeah, I, I, I believe that too. And another thing that happened with my, when my daughter was a baby, my youngest daughter, when she was a baby, she used to sob like a woman, you know, how like babies will usually be like, she would sob like a woman.

And I remember thinking, man, she’s so sweet. How can she be so sad? As she got a little older, she started telling me about Lindsay, this friend that was this big. She’d say, Lindsay’s this big, and we would have to be careful where we sat, because she’d say, don’t sit on Lindsay. And then one day, Lindsay was gone, and I said, where did Lindsay go?

And she said, Lindsay was hit by a car. And now that she’s an adult, I’ve asked her about Lindsay. And she says, I don’t, all I can remember was that she was little and she was dressed in pink. She doesn’t remember telling, telling me that she was hit by a car. It was the strangest thing and I, I really started to think.

There really is something. I really do think that children have some kind of clairvoyance. Yeah, that maybe we lose as we get older and maybe some people don’t lose and that’s why there are people who are clairvoyant.

I’ve mentioned this maybe once before in the six years of the podcast, but I think it’s worth mentioning again.

My grandma and I would sit on the couch when I lived with her and just watch Sylvia Brom Brown on Montel, you know back in the 90s. Whenever she would come on, we would just be enthralled. And Sylvia would always say when people would ask her, where’s heaven? She’d say, it’s right here. It’s right on top of us.

It’s, and I never quite got that. And I kind of shoot it away. Like that can’t be true. You know, like heaven has to be this far distant away place. And then with my own daughter, we were watching Ant Man. I don’t know if it was like 10 years ago when it first came out. And there’s a visual that you see in Ant Man where it just totally clicked for me.

And I had that aha moment where you see how small, small is that if you were to be the size of a dust mite, how different everything would look around you. And through those Ant Man movies, spirits started to say, it’s all right here. That infinite. Infinity isn’t just infinitely big, it’s infinitely small.

And I really do believe that that plays a role in like the veil that we talk about. That if you could see how small things were and how much is right here, we’d recognize that both heaven and earth kind of coexist simultaneously, right next to each other. Does that make sense?

Yeah. Yeah. I love that. Yeah.

It’s very interesting.

Yeah, so tell us one of your favorite stories about Your

clients. Yeah, tell

us a

few. So one of my favorites is So when we’re when we’re talking with with people who are dying when I in my practice I like to kind of know where they are in the dying process. I want to be able to Let the family know, you know, keep them informed.

So I have questions that I ask, and I do ask them if they are seeing anything. And I had this patient who was an elderly lady, and she always insisted on, this was home hospice when I was a home hospice nurse, insisted on sitting at the kitchen table with me. And, and. I could see that the, the trek from her room out to the kitchen table was taking its toll on her.

She was getting weaker and weaker and it was harder and I knew that she was failing. So one day we’re sitting at the kitchen table and I said, do you, are you seeing anything out of the ordinary? And she said, well, what do you mean? And I said, well, like people who have died before you. Oh no, no, nothing like that.

And I said, oh, okay. Cause you know, that’s really normal. And she said, it is. And I said, yeah. And she said, well, My dad standing in the kitchen, and she was in her 80s, so I knew without even looking, but I did anyway, that he wasn’t in there. And, uh, and she said, I didn’t want to say anything because I thought you would think I was crazy.

And I said, no, no, that’s perfectly normal. So she was reticent to talk about it. So some people when they’re deathbed visioning aren’t telling us because they don’t always tell you, you know, and we don’t always ask. And a lot of times we don’t probe further too. It’s their moment. And so we’re asking them, but I’m not going to say, well, what’s he wearing?

What’s he saying? What’s he doing? You know, because it’s like, okay, she’s confirmed. Now I know what’s going on. But I did have one patient who I asked. So he was in the care center and his wife had died a year before him and they had the same caregiver that was taking care of them. And I, his room was right next to the nurse’s station and I hear him yelling and I go into the room and he’s looking up at the corner of the room and he’s crying.

He’s got tears just pouring down his face and he’s yelling, Ingrid, Ingrid. And I said, Was Ingrid your wife? And he says, Yes! Yes! She’s right there! I can see her! And I said, is she coming to get you? And he says, yes, yes, but not today, tomorrow. And I thought, well, that’s really specific. And he didn’t die the next day.

He died the day after that. And then a couple days later, the caregiver came in and I told her the story. And she says, well, it was always like Ingrid to be late.

That is so sweet. Wow. Um, any other stories that come to mind for you to share? I have so many.

I have a quick one and then I’ll tell you another one. That’s my, my story. So, uh, my patient was talking about seeing a baby girl. And her adult daughters were in the room, and they were like, well, she keeps talking about seeing a baby girl, but we don’t know, like, there were no baby girls who died in the family, so we don’t even know who she’s talking about.

Well, her sister came to visit, and her sister said, actually, She had a baby when she was a teenager and it died. So, uh, it was a family secret. The daughters did not know about and then when she was dying, she was visioning her, her baby died.

When it comes to this, I want to add another layer on top.

religion. I think so many people are taught in various different religions that you let the dead rest in peace. You say goodbye, like you don’t communicate with them. Do you think that that fear that comes from their belief system maybe is a reason that they don’t want to tell you about it? Sometimes, certain people.

I don’t know. I actually don’t know because I’ve never asked them. I mean, the only, the only incident that I know of is the lady I told you about where she just didn’t want to say it because she was, you know, concerned that I would think that something was wrong with her mentally. I, I think it’s plausible.

I think people who maybe don’t have a religious, I can give you a great example. So, So my, my dad died, um, it’s been like 15 years now, I think, since he died, and he came to me after his death. Now, I’m not religious, I’ve never been religious, but I did get like a spiritual awakening through my work as a hospice nurse.

And my dad, when he died, uh, I had been a hospice nurse for five years, so yeah, it was 15 years ago. So, um, I had already, like now, developed this belief in an afterlife, which I didn’t have before I became a hospice nurse. So I felt like I’m more connected to death, if that makes sense. So shortly after my dad died, he came to me, came to me in the form of energy, and I told my family about it.

Now, my brother’s an atheist, so he just dismissed it out of hand. My sister considered herself agnostic. Uh, and my mom, maybe agnostic, atheist, don’t even know, she never said. But, uh, But so my, my sister and my mom were kind of like, Hmm, if he came to you, why didn’t he come to us? And I said, well, I think I’m more open to it because I have this belief now in an afterlife and I’m connected to death.

Well, my sister started going through some hard times with her daughter who was a drug addict, really, really hard times and her husband

And through her meditation, which I now recognize was a form of prayer, she started seeing my dad, sitting on a bench with a dark figure, and my dad was advising her on what to do, basically saying, you know what to do. And, and so this Hugely impactful to her. Like she made some decisions about her daughter that were so incredibly hard for her to make, evicting her, cutting ties, cutting her phone off, all these things, going to court and getting emergency custody of her granddaughter, which was huge.

But my dad was. Kind of guiding her through this with the help of this dark figure as she met. And by the way, just spoiler alert My niece has now been she had a beautiful she was pregnant at the time. She had a beautiful Um healthy baby girl She got custody of her older daughter back from my sister She’s clean nine years now a beautiful situation that ended up being Uh, I just always like to throw that in there ahead of time.

Like this was not tragic This was a beautiful outcome and so my dad’s The image of my dad starts to fade, but this dark figure stays there more prominent, and to this day now, my sister says, I do believe in God. She’s like, I’m not a Christian, I’m not religious, but I believe in God. My mom, even like years and years later, was still not having an experience.

And then one day she starts talking about seeing these wisps, and I said, what do you mean a wisp? And she said, I don’t know. It’s just a wisp. And I hear dad’s voice and he says things to me, like, be careful. And I said, well, that’s interesting. And she goes, yeah, but I don’t believe in an afterlife. Okay.

But she keeps telling me about these wisps. And then one day I finally, I was like, well, mom, do you think it’s dad? And she goes, well, yeah. And I said, well, then I guess you believe in an afterlife. Because so it was so interesting that we all had these different, like, Experiences and and my brother never did and never has and adamantly refuses to believe there’s anything beyond But but circling back to what you’re saying do why do people not tell us sometimes?

I think they do like Question what is it or if you are religious and you’re seeing things and it’s not angels and it’s not Jesus It’s your people that you knew in your life, you know, then that might be like, hmm I don’t know if I want to talk about this because it goes against everything that I believe in my life whether that’s I do Believe in God or I don’t believe in God or I do believe in the afterlife or I don’t believe in the afterlife

That’s so interesting.

So as we’ve been talking, the angels have been kind of bringing through this aha moment. You know, we talked about the babies seeing things, older folks, seeing things, and the angels always talk about belief and faith being such a big part of our own free will. We choose to believe certain things. And that’s why, you know, the words of mindset.

Set and belief systems were so big in the nineties and the two thousands. Um, but it’s so big because you can choose to believe and have faith and work through your limiting beliefs. And if you want to develop these skills in yourself, you absolutely can. Um, if you believe that you can. I believe that you have an easier time with it, that you can tune into these different tools, uh, that you’re talking about meditation, prayer.

I have an angel membership and an angel Reiki school that helps people step into their gifts. Um, but. It’s something that you can learn how to raise your energy up to connect more with the other side and, and make that a choice. Um, you talk about in the book, you know, reframing, dying to live better. What has this work taught you?

And really, um, there’s a difference between knowing something and seeing Parts of your life shift in your every day because of this new knowledge that you know How has it changed your life and how you live?

Well, I don’t wait to do things that I feel like Our experiences that I want to have in my life.

I think that’s the big thing. My husband and I, during the pandemic, sheltered in place in our cabin in the mountains and decided that he should retire early and my job became completely virtual. I work in hospice quality now, so I don’t do patient care anymore. Uh, and so we just. Kind of threw caution to the wind and sold our home in the city and and moved to the mountains where it’s Just there’s peace.

There’s so much peace there. So I think that was the major thing that it did for me it took, you know, probably 17 years before I did that through working with hospice but that was the the thing is like the really the life is short, you know, and you really need to I also feel like It’s made me a kinder person, uh, not always nice.

I can be not nice to people, but I’m always, I feel like I’m a kinder person. I care about people more. Uh, I want to help others. I don’t judge people. Uh, I feel like, um, people that have less than or marginalized. Um, deserve to have less judgment and a better chance at a good life, if that makes sense.

Mm hmm.

Less judgment all around. Um, Yeah, I think that judgment piece is a huge part of coming into your spirituality that, uh, I could see back through the generations. I was a history major where sometimes being critical or controlling or judgmental actually helped, you know, in the 1900s, you know, or 1920s and, and kind of in the time of my grandma and my mom.

Um, but then that, Kind of doesn’t help anymore. And when it comes to spirituality, that judgment of others. Creates a cage for them. And really there’s just this ultimate freedom when you allow yourself to just be naturally who you are, completely authentically who you are and live it and let everybody else do the same.

It’s just very, very freeing. And that’s where I think we can make this place heaven on earth. That’s a big part of it. Non judgment.

Yeah, yeah, well that what you’re just saying about that, that’s something else too that has really changed in me and that is to be authentically who I am. And I think that that was something that I didn’t really experience when I was younger.

I was always trying to be someone else. Because I thought that would make me happy to be someone else, to be somewhere else. And I’ve just, I’ve just really found so much peace in my life that I never could have imagined. One of the things I talk about in my book is that, you know, when I, when I, I’m a boomer.

I, and I lived through the eighties in the bars and, and I drank and I partied. I was a clubber and I could never imagine back in those days that I would be somebody who lives in an off grid cabin in the mountains and actually finds peace there. Wow. It never would have been something that, because I was so unhappy.

Unfulfilled and so unhappy in my life with myself and, and now, uh, I feel so differently. And, you know, the other thing about reframing dying for better living is not fearing it.

So

many people fear it. And part of that comes from accepting it, accepting that it’s going to happen, being okay with talking about it and understanding that.

It’s a part of the circle of life and whatever lies beyond this life, we don’t get to reach unless we end this life, you know, this life has to end for the next one to begin. And so I think that’s really important to, you know, to, to just really recognize that death is not something to be feared. It’s something that happens to all of us and we cannot control that.

And the more that we fight that the better. The worse that our death experience will be, whether we’re experiencing the death of the person who we love, or our, or we’re the person dying, it’s going to be not a good death if we are so fearful of it.

And that is fascinating. I’ve got a friend now who’s a nurse.

And she talks about helping people through this. There is a way to make it easier on yourself. What does that look like?

Well, acceptance again, that’s the main thing is understanding that it’s going to happen, uh, from the physical or biological standpoint, taking the advice of the medical professionals who are trying to help with easing those symptoms, making sure that those symptoms are managed because that’s something people really fight, but I, I really think just acceptance is the best thing, being able to talk about it.

So many times a person who’s dying wants to be able to talk about that with their family, but they’re afraid that it’s going to make them sad and the family doesn’t want to talk about it because they don’t want their person to give up hope and die faster, which they won’t because you’re going to die when you’re going to die.

And. Not having hope or having hope has no impact on that. And so there’s no conversation about it. So really to have the best staff, being able to talk about it and acknowledge this is happening. And these are all the things that I want to say to you. These are all the things that, that I want you to hear from me, whether you’re the person that’s dying or whether it’s, like I said, whether you’re the person that’s dying or whether it’s your family that’s dying.

Having that communication, people really have a lot of regret after their person died if they were not able to say goodbye to them. If they weren’t in the room with them, which happens all the time, you know, we believe that people have control sometimes over when they die and they wait for the room to empty out before they die.

It happens all the time. And so people just have guilt and regret over the things that they didn’t get a chance to say. And so when we are able to dialogue and say, This is happening. I am dying. Let’s talk about it. That is the best way to create a good death.

Wow. Nurse Penny, thank you so much for the work that you do.

I want you to tell everybody where they can find you, uh, where they can find your book.

So my book is available, uh, anywhere books are sold online. It’s called Influencing Death, Reframing Dying for Better Living. I don’t know if we’re on video, but this is it right here. Uh, I have a podcast also. It’s called Death Happens, An Insider’s Guide to Dying.

Listen wherever pods are. And I can be found on social media, TikTok, Instagram, YouTube, and Facebook at HospiceNursePenny.

Oh, beautiful. Thank you so much for being here. And thank you again for the work that you do for this world.

Thank you so much, Julie. I really appreciate you having me on.

Perfect.

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Friends. I love you so incredibly much sending you so much love and angelic blessings. I’ll see you next Thursday. I’ll see you Thursday. All right. Love you friends. Bye.